Autocross Starting Technique - Page 2 - Porsche 718 Forum
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post #11 of 21 Old 03-25-2019, 10:59 AM Thread Starter
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Went well. I did not hit any cones. I don't think anybody launched all day. To answer my own question, I think it does have something to do with how quickly the first turn shows up.

I thought I would have trouble memorizing and/or reading the course, and I did. There was one quadrant that had two distinct jogs to the right (course run clockwise - that is fundamentally a map of the course, but shows nothing in the way of critical detail). That's where I made all my errors. 3 DNF's out of 6 runs.

Missed one of the jogs to the right. On the second run, I managed to over-correct, and went through a previous gate backwards (car still pointed forward, to be clear, but going back in the wrong direction). I got an instructor in the car for the third run, and posted a 73.

Fourth run was a low 69, and the instructor came up to tell me, at below 70, I was now "doing well". Playing with house money, I missed the right hand jog again on the fifth run. Craving another result, I got a high 69 on the last run.

In my morning group, The Fast Guys were doing low 60's. The guy I met and hung with, who had done 10 or 12 autocrosses, had a best time of a mid 67. The Really Fast Guys intentionally waited for the warmer afternoon group, and I think the best time of the day was a 59.

All my runs mechanically identical - full PSM, PASM hard, Sport+ mode. Car slid around a fair amount - no tire squealing; no warning. And I guess the full PSM slowed me down to a crawl on at least one sweeper. I wish I had tried soft PASM - I think that might have improved some contact and traction, and maybe saved some time lost to PSM control.

I am pleased. I righted the ship and significantly dealt with my problems of course reading and memorization. I think I put up decent numbers for a 60 year old novice. I think I'm ready to start recovering lost time through modifications of my inputs, and of the car set up. I'll bet The Fast Guys and up start working on these things during the walk through; I don't know if I could ever get to that point.
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300 is plenty, 350's too many, and 365 is not enough.
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post #12 of 21 Old 03-25-2019, 12:14 PM
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Sounds like a fun day! Congrats on getting out there and pushing yourself hard enough to make mistakes (in the right environment) and learn from them.

Cheers.
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post #13 of 21 Old 03-25-2019, 06:20 PM
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Originally Posted by duegatti View Post
Went well. I did not hit any cones. ...
I am pleased. I righted the ship and significantly dealt with my problems of course reading and memorization. I think I put up decent numbers for a 60 year old novice. I think I'm ready to start recovering lost time through modifications of my inputs, and of the car set up. I'll bet The Fast Guys and up start working on these things during the walk through; I don't know if I could ever get to that point.
Sounds like a fun. Great effort! I assume it was a fairly tight circuit suited to smaller cars like a 718? Personally, I have never been that good on those cone circuits but I guess practice makes perfect.

Curious to know what sort of cars were in the event and which ones were doing the faster times? Although I know the driver makes a big difference.

2019 Cayman GTS GT Silver arrived...

Last edited by don; 03-25-2019 at 06:22 PM. Reason: shortened
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post #14 of 21 Old 03-25-2019, 08:46 PM
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Originally Posted by johan View Post
Thats the correct way but click once on the PSM button.
A couple of times should be Ok but in the long run who knows!
I only forwarding info i have read about it, logic says that the launch control should be taking care of these things.
But if i turn the PSM in sport mode it launches quicker and harder and it could only depend on how the clutch engages.


I shall see if i cant get a source on it.


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The owner's manual doesn't mention anything about pressing the PSM button

Page 264 | 2017-2019 718 Cayman Manual | Porsche iManuals
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post #15 of 21 Old 03-25-2019, 09:05 PM
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Originally Posted by phroenips View Post
The owner's manual doesn't mention anything about pressing the PSM button

Page 264 | 2017-2019 718 Cayman Manual | Porsche iManuals
Yep i know
The logic behind the statement that it is better for the car with PSM off sounds ok for me.
Now days it is No Go for wheel spin when leaving the pit (safety reasons) on many tracks.
The reason for wheel spin is that its better for the clutch then to drag it.

The tests i have done with PSM On bogs down the car and it is hesitent to start.
With PSM in sport mode tha car just goes as bat out of h(e)ll

For the fun of it.....
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post #16 of 21 Old 03-25-2019, 09:14 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by don View Post
Sounds like a fun. Great effort! I assume it was a fairly tight circuit suited to smaller cars like a 718? Personally, I have never been that good on those cone circuits but I guess practice makes perfect.

Curious to know what sort of cars were in the event and which ones were doing the faster times? Although I know the driver makes a big difference.
The guy that I met and hung with described this as a "medium" course. 20 cars total. Very difficult to put car/driver/result together at this thing - nothing was posted, and the written results would need to be photographed, and I'm not sure both driver and car were identified on that sheet with the times. So I can't say. I did gather that there were several serious, seasoned competitors and several significantly modified cars.

There were a lot of mid engined cars - more than the 911's. Some of them were among the fast guys. There was a GT3. One newer 911, a couple of old turbo 911's. A modified 924 and a modified 944, I believe. A 2 door BMW, modified. A Cayenne. Very, very few cones were hit. A couple of spins.






The 0.96 and the 1.26 were new that day.
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300 is plenty, 350's too many, and 365 is not enough.
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post #17 of 21 Old 03-26-2019, 05:26 AM
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Hi duegatti, I'm glad you found autocross to enjoy such a fantastic car. The first rule is to just have fun and enjoy!! You didn't mention whether or not you walked the course before your runs - I'd recommend you do this 2-3 times before your drive it. Another good idea is to ride with someone who has a car very similar to yours - you pick up some good tips when doing this.

I'm jealous because I haven't been able to autocross mine yet -- but I will! I've been autocrossing for over ten years in other cars and I'm not anywhere near as good as I'd like to be - but what a blast!!!! Have fun!
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post #18 of 21 Old 03-26-2019, 09:43 AM Thread Starter
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I did walk the course once, but knowing nothing, I did not know what to look for, didn't get the value out of it. That will get better. We also had a driving parade lap, and there I did see a single apex approach to a pair of turns, and that saved me using a run to figure that out.

The club began prohibiting passengers, unless the passenger is an instructor - which is what I did on my third run. I do think there is a chance that they would allow me as a passenger in an instructor driven car - but there's a good chance that would make me puke, to be blunt.

I'm overall happy with there I am on the learning curve.

300 is plenty, 350's too many, and 365 is not enough.
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post #19 of 21 Old 03-26-2019, 10:32 AM
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Originally Posted by duegatti View Post
I did walk the course once, but knowing nothing, I did not know what to look for, didn't get the value out of it.
It's great that you had a great time. That's what it's all about anyway, unless there is a huge pot of cash waiting for the winner!

Walking the course is crucial to doing well (even though doing well isn't the main goal). Here are some things to think about, besides just learning how the turns goes so you don't miss them. First, just visualize running through the course, especially the tough corners. It's like an athlete visualizing a downhill ski run, it prepares you mentally. Second, think about the best line through each corner. It's not always the way everyone seems to be running it. You can brake harder than you can accelerate, so given the choice between braking and accelerating later at a pylon vs. braking and accelerating earlier, earlier almost always wins. That means setting up properly for each turn, not just driving to get there. Hence having an idea of which you want to be going when you get there, not just getting there. Imagine how to smooth things out.

I've seen two drivers use the same car, one seemingly driving hard and all over the course, the other smooth and seemingly not working hard at all, with the smoother driver winning by more than a second over the a roughly 1 minute course.

Jim, on my second Porsche. The first was a 912 in a long time ago in a galaxy far, far away.

Last edited by jimmuller; 03-26-2019 at 10:35 AM.
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post #20 of 21 Old 03-26-2019, 10:57 AM Thread Starter
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That's another level that I've begun imagining. Like those two jogs to the right that gave me so much trouble. They weren't in front of me; I didn't see them. So I initially viewed them as a memorization problem, but then you get to thinking that maybe it would be better to come out of that turn pointed more toward that gate, and get there more easily.

As I said, there was no feedback between what I saw and what the results were. I didn't even know the people, so I couldn't make that match even when I was looking at the hand written results at the end. I didn't feel it was appropriate to take my phone out and try to time cars when I was spotting.

300 is plenty, 350's too many, and 365 is not enough.
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