[Gtipirelli]

I was handed the keys to a 2018 Cayman GTS manual today whilst my 2017 Cayman S was having the side pod vent recall thingy

This is in no way a ‘versus’ thread but I did observe a few differences that I thought I would share

- it had 7k miles so was well run in. Mine has 9k
- the manual immediately made you feel more connected after driving a PDK for the last two months
- the experience made me drive mine in manual mode on collection and I felt just as connected. I conclude that the PDK encourage lazy driving
- the manual was pulling 3k RPM doing 66 mph where as the PDK was pulling 1800RPM at the same speed. My mpg over the exact route of about 20 miles was almost identical. The big difference is obviously the 7th tall gear on motorways where it is doing 80 mph at just over 2k rpm
- the alcantara steering wheel felt lovely in the GTS
- the GTS had full heated bucket seats that actually felt very comfortable but were a pain to extract yourself out of
- the power felt no different between the two cars
- the standard body kit made the car look more aggressive than mine. Both mine and the GTS are black cars
- the GTS had 20’ alloys and PASM and the car felt like it had a lot harder ride than my S with PASM and 19’ alloys. I wonder if the GTS had the sports lowered suspension but happy with the ride on mine even though the 20’s look nicer
- both cars sounded the same bit when the sports exhaust was turned on and in sports mode the pops and crackles were nice in the GTS. It is an option if fitted standard that you won’t regret. Not sure I would pay for it though

My main conclusion is that I need to drive my car more regularly in manual mode PDK and in sports mode and to stop letting the car row through the gears itself.

 

[johan]

I was handed the keys to a 2018 Cayman GTS manual today whilst my 2017 Cayman S was having the side pod vent recall thingy

This is in no way a ‘versus’ thread but I did observe a few differences that I thought I would share

- it had 7k miles so was well run in. Mine has 9k
- the manual immediately made you feel more connected after driving a PDK for the last two months
- the experience made me drive mine in manual mode on collection and I felt just as connected. I conclude that the PDK encourage lazy driving
- the manual was pulling 3k RPM doing 66 mph where as the PDK was pulling 1800RPM at the same speed. My mpg over the exact route of about 20 miles was almost identical. The big difference is obviously the 7th tall gear on motorways where it is doing 80 mph at just over 2k rpm
- the alcantara steering wheel felt lovely in the GTS
- the GTS had full heated bucket seats that actually felt very comfortable but were a pain to extract yourself out of
- the power felt no different between the two cars
- the standard body kit made the car look more aggressive than mine. Both mine and the GTS are black cars
- the GTS had 20’ alloys and PASM and the car felt like it had a lot harder ride than my S with PASM and 19’ alloys. I wonder if the GTS had the sports lowered suspension but happy with the ride on mine even though the 20’s look nicer
- both cars sounded the same bit when the sports exhaust was turned on and in sports mode the pops and crackles were nice in the GTS. It is an option if fitted standard that you won’t regret. Not sure I would pay for it though

My main conclusion is that I need to drive my car more regularly in manual mode PDK and in sports mode and to stop letting the car row through the gears itself.

I gone from BS,CS to BGTS and the GTS feels faster and have a wider power band, but thats me.
Also if the GTS is one of the loaners they have god knows how it has been driven.
On the pdk subject, i rarely drive in auto mode for the same reason as you mentioned

 

[Baka1969]

Interesting observations. Do you think if the GTS had the PDK that there would be a big enough difference over the S that you would prefer the GTS?

 

[Uz718]

I was handed the keys to a 2018 Cayman GTS manual today whilst my 2017 Cayman S was having the side pod vent recall thingy

This is in no way a ‘versus’ thread but I did observe a few differences that I thought I would share

- it had 7k miles so was well run in. Mine has 9k
- the manual immediately made you feel more connected after driving a PDK for the last two months
- the experience made me drive mine in manual mode on collection and I felt just as connected. I conclude that the PDK encourage lazy driving
- the manual was pulling 3k RPM doing 66 mph where as the PDK was pulling 1800RPM at the same speed. My mpg over the exact route of about 20 miles was almost identical. The big difference is obviously the 7th tall gear on motorways where it is doing 80 mph at just over 2k rpm
- the alcantara steering wheel felt lovely in the GTS
- the GTS had full heated bucket seats that actually felt very comfortable but were a pain to extract yourself out of
- the power felt no different between the two cars
- the standard body kit made the car look more aggressive than mine. Both mine and the GTS are black cars
- the GTS had 20’ alloys and PASM and the car felt like it had a lot harder ride than my S with PASM and 19’ alloys. I wonder if the GTS had the sports lowered suspension but happy with the ride on mine even though the 20’s look nicer
- both cars sounded the same bit when the sports exhaust was turned on and in sports mode the pops and crackles were nice in the GTS. It is an option if fitted standard that you won’t regret. Not sure I would pay for it though

My main conclusion is that I need to drive my car more regularly in manual mode PDK and in sports mode and to stop letting the car row through the gears itself.

Hey A!
Agree re the manual... I had a manual 981B and I miss the extra involvement but because I do crazy mileage the manual definitely got tiring... Pdk is a nice mix in manual mode.

 

[Gtipirelli]

Uz, I mostly use my car to commute hence why the PDK is a no brainer. Used in manual mode however felt very similar to a manual car

I would soon tire of rowing a manual gearbox in a sports car in heavy traffic

 

[Gtipirelli]

Interesting observations. Do you think if the GTS had the PDK that there would be a big enough difference over the S that you would prefer the GTS?

Hi Baka

Good question, I think it depends on the spec
If you were heavily optioning an S then it makes sense to go GTS because of the perceived discount you get by Porsche packaging those options

Yesterday’s GTS felt and looked very similar to my S so the difference was marginal. Both cars have black full leather with contrast silver stitching, both had Bose, PASM, sports chrono, sports multi function steering wheel etc

It was only the seats and alcantara steering wheel that was different on the interior so it felt almost like my own

However there were a couple of GTS Caymans at our recent meet-up where the interiors were stunning and a real notch up - AJ and Tim you know who you are ?

The beauty of Porsche is that it lets you personalise your own car and a base model can feel just as sporty or luxurious as the top model.

Alan

 

[timlaw]

I drive mine as a daily so no brainer for the PDK

I use the paddles a lot but sport and sport plus in auto are still mighty impressive

I do leave it in normal far too much

two tone leather interior is a fab option and about £1500 on the GTS - almost a bargain

Tim

 

[My718isPorsche#5]

I was going to make an offer on a new 2018 GTS next week. After reading this I think I'll order the S and save about $10,000. In 3 or 4 years when it is time to part company the GTS will probably worth a lot more than the S.

 

[Gtipirelli]

Please don’t make a decision based on my very short driving experience

You have to weigh up the whole package against what you are looking for in a vehicle and for how long you are looking to keep it

There is very little difference performance wise between GTS and S but the interior packages really can differentiate them and the GTS will generally depreciate less

I could have saved myself £10k and gone for the perfectly good base car but we all make personal choices

 

[timlaw]

cayman T might be interesting next year - all the fun handling bits and less than a basic S without the handling extras

might be the "driver's" choice in manual as I doubt if the base engine's 300 bhp leaves the cars underpowered

 

[Basaltbox]

I think it’s just marketing.

GTS with PDK will be hard to beat.

 

[ZuffenHouseRules]

I doubt if the base engine's 300 bhp leaves the cars underpowered

I reckon none of the 718 variants, with either engine, are underpowered relative to weight....as evidenced by their real-world speed.

The thing is, this mid-engine platform has so much handling -- you could say it 'over-handles' as compared to other sportscars and even (to some extent) the 911. So the platform could easily handle more power, and the 9A2B4 turbo has more to give this package (but Porsche is capping it so as not to outperform big-brother 911).

Now, if you want to exploit an abundance of handling and can't add more power (putting aside after-market flash tuning), then the alternative is to 'add lightness' in Colin Chapman's expression.

This is where I think the formula for spec-ing out the ultimate performance value thrill-to-drive 718 (off-track) starts with a raw un-optioned S. Under 3000 lbs., manual gerabox, 2.5/VTG, retro Porsche-tuned suspension (non-adaptive). Then swap out the OE 19" wheels for ultralight 20" OZ Racing rims with Michelin PS4S or even Pilot Cup 2s (climate permitting), taking out a few more pounds of unsprung weight at each corner. Top with a Cobb or better yet the Ehresmann flash-only tune for 400hp in a lightweight package with more power and more lightness.

I'll call it the 718 RS Street formula.

 

[Baka1969]

I reckon none of the 718 variants, with either engine, are underpowered relative to weight....as evidenced by their real-world speed.

The thing is, this mid-engine platform has so much handling -- you could say it 'over-handles' as compared to other sportscars and even (to some extent) the 911. So the platform could easily handle more power, and the 9A2B4 turbo has more to give this package (but Porsche is capping it so as not to outperform big-brother 911).

Now, if you want to exploit an abundance of handling and can't add more power (putting aside after-market flash tuning), then the alternative is to 'add lightness' in Colin Chapman's expression.

This is where I think the formula for spec-ing out the ultimate performance value thrill-to-drive 718 (off-track) starts with a raw un-optioned S. Under 3000 lbs., manual gerabox, 2.5/VTG, retro Porsche-tuned suspension (non-adaptive). Then swap out the OE 19" wheels for ultralight 20" OZ Racing rims with Michelin PS4S or even Pilot Cup 2s (climate permitting), taking out a few more pounds of unsprung weight at each corner. Top with a Cobb or better yet the Ehresmann flash-only tune for 400hp in a lightweight package with more power and more lightness.

I'll call it the 718 RS Street formula.

I agree. The 991.2 platform handled 700 hp. I would bet the 718 platform could easily handle over 500 hp. The only real reason the current Boxster/Cayman platforms are considered "lesser" cars (according to Porsche) is because Porsche restricts their power. It certainly isn't because they're less capable.

Heck, if Dodge can shove a 700+ hp engine in what is essentially a $25,000 chassis, the 718 family has a lot more to give than 365 (current) hp.

 

[Nosmo]

I was handed the keys to a 2018 Cayman GTS manual today whilst my 2017 Cayman S was having the side pod vent recall thingy

This is in no way a ‘versus’ thread but I did observe a few differences that I thought I would share

- it had 7k miles so was well run in. Mine has 9k
- the manual immediately made you feel more connected after driving a PDK for the last two months
- the experience made me drive mine in manual mode on collection and I felt just as connected. I conclude that the PDK encourage lazy driving
- the manual was pulling 3k RPM doing 66 mph where as the PDK was pulling 1800RPM at the same speed. My mpg over the exact route of about 20 miles was almost identical. The big difference is obviously the 7th tall gear on motorways where it is doing 80 mph at just over 2k rpm
- the alcantara steering wheel felt lovely in the GTS
- the GTS had full heated bucket seats that actually felt very comfortable but were a pain to extract yourself out of
- the power felt no different between the two cars
- the standard body kit made the car look more aggressive than mine. Both mine and the GTS are black cars
- the GTS had 20’ alloys and PASM and the car felt like it had a lot harder ride than my S with PASM and 19’ alloys. I wonder if the GTS had the sports lowered suspension but happy with the ride on mine even though the 20’s look nicer
- both cars sounded the same bit when the sports exhaust was turned on and in sports mode the pops and crackles were nice in the GTS. It is an option if fitted standard that you won’t regret. Not sure I would pay for it though

My main conclusion is that I need to drive my car more regularly in manual mode PDK and in sports mode and to stop letting the car row through the gears itself.

I agree with the 20" comment. Since changing to the 18" winter set the ride is a lot more comfortable. The bigger side walls are massively noticeable from a comfort perspective. Although I'm unlikely to push the winter set, I'm sure the bigger rims will have their merits on a spirited drive.

 

[Gtipirelli]

I agree with the 20" comment. Since changing to the 18" winter set the ride is a lot more comfortable. The bigger side walls are massively noticeable from a comfort perspective. Although I'm unlikely to push the winter set, I'm sure the bigger rims will have their merits on a spirited drive.

Totally agree, the larger rims do look a lot better though. 19 is probably the best compromise but I would think you would need 20”s if you were tracking it a lot. I would love the larger rims but with the ride comfort I get from the 19s. First world problems

 

[johan]

If you gonna track 18" or 19", there is a reason why race cars have taler sidewalls

 

[GTS]

I personally wish I could have ordered my GTS without the 20's. They look nice, but make me cringe every time I hit even the smallest of potholes or bumps. I'll downsize next spring, most likely. It's too bad Porsche doesn't offer no cost changes like that on the configurator.

 

[johan]

I personally wish I could have ordered my GTS without the 20's. They look nice, but make me cringe every time I hit even the smallest of potholes or bumps. I'll downsize next spring, most likely. It's too bad Porsche doesn't offer no cost changes like that on the configurator.

In Sweden we dont have many potholes and in my first 718 (pasm) i felt the ride where harsch for DD.
It was a relief to put on the 19" winter tires and now i have S-pasm and dont really mind it any more

 

[Viffermike]

If you gonna track 18" or 19", there is a reason why race cars have taler sidewalls

This. With all due respect to @ZuffenHouseRules and his 718 RS comments above, 20-inch rims on such a car would be a mistake. On average, lightweight 20-inch wheels weigh 3-4 pounds more than their 19-inch equivalent counterparts each -- and tires weigh another 4-5 pounds more each. That's more than 30 pounds of unsprung weight minimum you'd save the drivetrain from having to spin up, the suspension from having to control, and the brakes from having to slow down. Inertia's not your friend in this case ...

... and to @johan 's point about race cars having taller sidewalls: A performance car places regular amounts of an incredible amount of torsional and off-axis stress on a tire's sidewall. Performance tires are designed to both take this stress and transmit it in as predictable way as possible to the operator. However, the shorter a tire's sidewall is, the less ability it has to do this -- particularly the transmission part. It's this effect that is the biggest factor in why racing tires aren't low-profile like street tires tend to be. When road feel really matters, a taller sidewall is the driver's distinct buddy.

I gotta say: If the 718 Cayman T is meant to be a lightweight 'stripper' 718 for pure enthusiasts, why doesn't it have the 2.5? Seems to me that @ZuffenHouseRules' argument is being contradicted by Porsche ... ?

 

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WHAT about driving in sports PLUS - How would that compare ? Also any thoughts on the new 911?