Porsche 718 Forum banner
21 - 39 of 39 Posts
granted the engine is all alloy - one of my cars (all alloy engine) is every 4 years / 50k and the other is aluminum heads / cast iron block with long life coolant is 10 years / 150k - unless otherwise indicated for replacement sooner

I'm skeptical of "lifetime" claims - and hearing of the water pump leaks that seem to turn up...
A few manufacturers or maybe one i would believe it lasts 100k miles solid. Toyota. Not sure about or thers. 150k miles is a little whacky. And ten years is impossibly tested for all use cases.
 
yes alloy = aluminum alloy

otherwise, if not alloy its typically cast iron construction
Oh I see where the problem is . :)
"Alloy" itself is not equal to aluminum alloy.
Cast iron , stainless steel , your ring on your finger , etc almost everything is alloy .
Without defining what kind of alloy it does not mean anything 😉

Stainless steel for example:
Cast iron:
 
Oh I see where the problem is . :)
"Alloy" itself is not equal to aluminum alloy.
Cast iron , stainless steel , your ring on your finger , etc almost everything is alloy .
Without defining what kind of alloy it does not mean anything 😉

Stainless steel for example:
Cast iron:
It was my reference to the context I was using of aluminum vs. cast iron. There's still engines in production that have cast iron blocks & aluminum heads
- in some instances the NA versions might be all aluminum and forced induction uses cast iron for more strength

for decades, I've referred to "alloy" blocks as being of aluminum construction and some parts could be magnesium alloy (valve covers, intake manifolds, et.al.) vs. cast iron

similarly they term "alloy wheels" meaning they're aluminum alloy or combination aluminum / magnesium components vs. the older style steel wheels. Alloy wheels in the 'states turned up more in the 80s, where European makes were using alloy aluminum in the 60s

Here in the 'states - cast iron was the typical material and aluminum was not commonly used until well into the 80s. There were some applications with aluminum heads, but it wasn't widespread
 
It was my reference to the context I was using of aluminum vs. cast iron. There's still engines in production that have cast iron blocks & aluminum heads
- in some instances the NA versions might be all aluminum and forced induction uses cast iron for more strength

for decades, I've referred to "alloy" blocks as being of aluminum construction and some parts could be magnesium alloy (valve covers, intake manifolds, et.al.) vs. cast iron

similarly they term "alloy wheels" meaning they're aluminum alloy or combination aluminum / magnesium components vs. the older style steel wheels. Alloy wheels in the 'states turned up more in the 80s, where European makes were using alloy aluminum in the 60s

Here in the 'states - cast iron was the typical material and aluminum was not commonly used until well into the 80s. There were some applications with aluminum heads, but it wasn't widespread
I know now.
Then its just a bad use of wording in US daily life probably, as cast iron is also an alloy.

It has to be similar to when some time people speak about suspension but using the chassis word instead. We also have bad habit of missusing words :)
 
Then its just a bad use of wording in US daily life probably, as cast iron is also an alloy.
Hey now. Don't blame all of us :) and indeed I think that the misuse of alloy to refer to all things not made of cast iron or carbon steel is a British thing that we've simply been lazy about dropping as a habit.

We also have bad habit of missusing words :)
I always thought Germans had a bad habit of making up words. For example: Kraftfahrzeughaftpflichtversicherung .

I'm half-German. I like making up words.

:p
 
Hey now. Don't blame all of us :) and indeed I think that the misuse of alloy to refer to all things not made of cast iron or carbon steel is a British thing that we've simply been lazy about dropping as a habit.



I always thought Germans had a bad habit of making up words. For example: Kraftfahrzeughaftpflichtversicherung .

I'm half-German. I like making up words.

:p
yes - the German language has very specific words for technical terms - (studied German).

I remember my parents took our (new) VW in for service when we were stationed there - they marveled at one of the words on the work order had 21 letters...

and American English compared to British English...to say "liberties have been taken" would be an understatement
 
  • Like
Reactions: PeC
Hey now. Don't blame all of us :) and indeed I think that the misuse of alloy to refer to all things not made of cast iron or carbon steel is a British thing that we've simply been lazy about dropping as a habit.



I always thought Germans had a bad habit of making up words. For example: Kraftfahrzeughaftpflichtversicherung .

I'm half-German. I like making up words.

:p
No-no-no don`t get me wrong, I am far from blaming anybody I did not want to be harsh :)
Coming from a family of automotive engineering and also being an IT engineer I tend to be focus on correct specification :)
 
So... I remember that --^ stuff back in the day.

On topic, the current Porsche coolant is (or is identical to) Pentofrost E: https://crpautomotive.com/wp-conten...roduct-Data-Sheet-Antifreeze-Pentofrost-E.pdf

It, like all other coolants (at least those used by Germans) is enthylene glycol-based: https://crpautomotive.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/06/Pentosin-SDS-Antifreeze-Pentofrost-E-EN.pdf

What differentiates coolants is the formulation of the additive package.

Enthylene glycol eats aluminum. Heads and block in our Porsches are aluminum. The coolant additive package prevents the enthylene glycol from eating the aluminum.

In the old days coolant had silicates and phosphates as the major components of the additive packages. They work great. But, they also 'go away' after a couple of years so the change interval was frequent. The frequent change intervals, silicates and phosphates were deemed environmentally unsound. Manufacturers have been pushed for decades to increase change intervals and to use more 'environmentally-friendly' chemicals. There have been numerous reformulations of coolant over the last 30 years and there have been some disasters - as far as damage to cars is concerned - as a result. There have been no regulations that push manufactures to make sure that the coolant formulations do not turn engine blocks and heads into Swiss cheese after a decade or many tens of thousands of miles.

Anyone's faith in "lifetime fluid" is a bet on how long-lasting is the additive package and how well-matched it actually is for the materials with which it is in contact.

As someone who routinely sees what old/bad coolant does to aluminum Porsche heads (and blocks if left long enough) and has spent non-trivial time over the years researching coolants, I absolutely do not believe in lifetime coolants (or, indeed, lifetime automotive fluids of any flavor.)

If you are going to 'trade out' of your Porsche in 0 to 10 years then the only motivation to refresh fluids is "doing the right thing."

If you want to be driving your gas-powered mid-engined Porsche in 2035, you must treat all the fluids as wear items.

This is also a reminder to self to change the coolant (and PDK fluid) on my '15. It's past due based upon my own methodology even if it has only 25k-miles.
One of the additives in the coolant is to help prevent electrolysis. I don't know how long it takes to degrade and I don't want to find out. I saw an aluminum intake manifolds on a Ford (no jokes please) with 92,000 miles on it that had not had their coolant changed - ever. You could poke a hole in the manifold with your index finger. I change mine every 50,000 miles - cheap insurance.
 
I have a 2017 base cayman with 20,000 miles. I have looked in detail at the Porsche maintenance manual and nowhere does it say to change/flush the coolant. There are plenty of dealer sites that say to flush every 4 years, but they may just be looking for business. I want to go by what the manufacturer says.

Is the coolant lifetime?
No.
 
21 - 39 of 39 Posts
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top